Casino Boots Ronstadt for Praising Moore [Archive]

Michele

07-20-2004, 08:44 AM

http://channels.aimtoday.com/celebrity/story.jsp?floc=FF-APO-PLS&idq=/ff/story/0001/20040719/2246626942.htm&photoid=19901231NY119

Casino Boots Ronstadt for Praising Moore
By ADAM GOLDMAN

LAS VEGAS (AP) - Singer Linda Ronstadt not only got booed, she got the boot after praising filmmaker Michael Moore and his new movie ``Fahrenheit 9/11'' during a performance.

Before singing ``Desperado'' for an encore Saturday night, Ronstadt called Moore a ``great American patriot'' and ``someone who is spreading the truth.'' She also encouraged the audience at the Aladdin hotel-casino to see the documentary about President Bush.

Ronstadt's comments drew loud boos, and some of the 4,500 people in attendance stormed out of the theater. People also tore down concert posters and tossed cocktails into the air.

``It was a very ugly scene,'' Aladdin President Bill Timmins told The Associated Press. ``She praised him and all of a sudden all bedlam broke loose.''

Timmins, who is British and was watching the show, said he didn't allow Ronstadt back in her luxury suite afterward and she was escorted off the property.

Ronstadt's antics ``spoiled a wonderful evening for our guests and we had to do something about it,'' Timmins said.

Ronstadt, 58, had been booked to play the Aladdin for only one show.

On Monday, Moore released a letter to The Associated Press that he intends to send to Timmins.

``For you to throw Linda Ronstadt off the premises because she dared to say a few words in support of me and my film, is simply stupid and Un-American,'' Moore wrote.

Calls to Ronstadt's manager were not immediately returned.

In an interview with the Las Vegas Review-Journal before the show, Ronstadt said, ``I keep hoping that if I'm annoying enough to them, they won't hire me back.''

Timmins said Ronstadt would not sing at the Aladdin again: ``As long as I'm here, she's not going to play.''

Moore said Timmins owes Ronstadt an apology.

``I have an idea how you can make it up to her - and to the millions of Americans you have offended,'' Moore wrote. ``Invite her back and I'll join her in singing 'America the Beautiful' on your stage. Then I will show 'Fahrenheit 9/11' free of charge to all your guests and anyone else in Las Vegas who wants to see it.''

This just proves that entertainers are too full of themselves. People go to be entertained. Not hear political opinions. These people paid for a concert, not political opinions.

Do you think the casino had good cause to fire her?

kingclick

07-20-2004, 10:07 AM

They didn't fire her, they just ended her show early. And she will be paid in full/

I think that in light of her comments before the show, this was an appropriate action.

If I was the Casino Owner, I would take up Michael Moore on his offer.

Peanut

07-20-2004, 10:50 AM

This just proves that entertainers are too full of themselves. People go to be entertained. Not hear political opinions. These people paid for a concert, not political opinions.

Do you think the casino had good cause to fire her?

I have a BIG problem with "entertainers" using "entertainment foums/environments" as sounding boards for their political beliefs or personal grudges. There is a time and a place, and when people pay to hear you sing/act/whatever, they don't need the extra bonus political-leaning caveats added in simply because the entertainer is in a position of power or control. I like your voice, lady, but when you start embarassing yourself by acting or speaking inapropriately within your surroundings, your star dims.

They didn't fire her, they just ended her show early. And she will be paid in full/

I think that in light of her comments before the show, this was an appropriate action.

If I was the Casino Owner, I would take up Michael Moore on his offer.

I don't really care enough to read any further into this, and merely hope these entertainers remember their places soon. If what KL has stated is true, then I agree the Casino handled things more than apropriately. Furthermore, I would also take Moore up on his offer, in hopes that he would show up in person. Then, I would deliberately fill the audience with Republicans, conservatives, and Active Duty military members and their families.

I am evil that way.

GracieMae

07-20-2004, 11:00 AM

I totally agree with Peanut on everything she said!

kingclick

07-20-2004, 11:11 AM

I have a BIG problem with "entertainers" using "entertainment foums/environments" as sounding boards for their political beliefs or personal grudges. There is a time and a place, and when people pay to hear you sing/act/whatever, they don't need the extra bonus political-leaning caveats added in simply because the entertainer is in a position of power or control. I like your voice, lady, but when you start embarassing yourself by acting or speaking inapropriately within your surroundings, your star dims.

I don't really care enough to read any further into this, and merely hope these entertainers remember their places soon......
Ok. Maybe I'm a little confused here. What you are saying to these people is "SHUT UP" your place is not to speak or talk. Just sing? These are HUMAN BEINGS behind the voices and talents. But not only are they human beings with thoughts and opinions. They are for the most part Americans.

I may strongly disagree with Linda's point of view or Barbara Streisand or Whoopi, but I EVEN MORE STRONGLY SUPPORT their freedom to speak without being insulted by statements like "remember their place". Because their "PLACE" is to speak their mind and live with the consequences of speaking that peace.

GracieMae

07-20-2004, 11:18 AM

KL, my feelings are people pay money to hear an artist preform, not spout politatics. Polatics is such a touchy sublect for many people anyway.

Echo2

07-20-2004, 11:24 AM

I have to agree. She was being paid to preform and entertain. Not give political speaches. They have every right to not ask her to comeback.

As to excorting her from the premises and locking her out of her room? Hmmm? Sounds like a knee jerk reaction to me and possibly could have been handled better. Two wrongs don't make a right.

kingclick

07-20-2004, 11:36 AM

She was being paid to perform? No. She was being paid to entertain. And part of that entertaining is talking about what she wants to talk about. Now, the next time she may not get as many people attending her concerts, but I don't think that she needs to "remember her place". Because her place as an American is to choose how she runs her business. And entertaining is her business.

Michele

07-20-2004, 11:58 AM

I suppose if she had advertised her "entertainment" as a song and political speech dance at least it would have given people the choice as whether or not to attend. But she didn't. It was billed strictly as her SINGING.

If I pay to see singing, I expect that. Not to hear her personal political choice.

GracieMae

07-20-2004, 12:00 PM

Was it a political event? No. What if she had preached religion? She probably would have been booed off the stage for that too.

I do agree that she will probably not get as many people in her audience next time. Many people don't want to hear polatics when they are expecting to hear music.

Peanut

07-20-2004, 12:17 PM

If I pay to see singing, I expect that. Not to hear her personal political choice.

KL, I kind-of resent the implication that to do something like the casino did is to deny her her RIGHTS. She is selling something, and what most of the people BOUGHT was not her political viewpoint. It is more a case of commonsense and proper decorum within the CONTEXT OF HER SURROUNDINGS. If, at this concert, she had started spouting off about how abortion should be the inalienable right of every female of reproductive age, would you have found her political tirade less a case of "a god-given right" and more of an inappropriate rant?

However, if the information was provided in the course of a regular entertainment type-interview regarding her personal beliefs and political view of the issue; different context, different forum, different situational decorum. It is all about proper conduct and manners depending on your surroundings.

Echo2

07-20-2004, 12:22 PM

Great post peanut! I totally agree.

OnederWoman

07-20-2004, 12:36 PM

I think the audience was ridiculous to resort to throwing cocktails in the air. It's dangerous and childish. I think the owner, while acting well within his rights, was a bit extreme in escorting her off of the property.

I think Ms. Rondstadt was within her rights to speak her mind, just so happened she wasn't of the same mind as the majority of the patrons there. I don't pay to hear people's politics either, but if they make a statement in passing that I don't agree with, I'm not going to throw a hissy fit and hurl my drink at something. I think maybe just the booing would have gotten the point across. I think all parties involved were a bit ridiculous, Ms. Rondstadt being the least of it.

kingclick

07-20-2004, 12:56 PM

1. KL, I kind-of resent the implication that to do something like the casino did is to deny her her RIGHTS.

2. She is selling something, and what most of the people BOUGHT was not her political viewpoint. It is more a case of commonsense and proper decorum within the CONTEXT OF HER SURROUNDINGS.
3. If, at this concert, she had started spouting off about how abortion should be the inalienable right of every female of reproductive age, would you have found her political tirade less a case of "a god-given right" and more of an inappropriate rant?

However, if the information was provided in the course of a regular entertainment type-interview regarding her personal beliefs and political view of the issue; different context, different forum, different situational decorum. It is all about proper conduct and manners depending on your surroundings.
1. Please support this. I didn't give any implication of this, in fact....if you would read my first post....

They didn't fire her, they just ended her show early. And she will be paid in full/

I think that in light of her comments before the show, this was an appropriate action.

If I was the Casino Owner, I would take up Michael Moore on his offer.
2. Yes she is selling something. And if I don't like what she is selling. I wont attend the next time she comes to town and I will tell everyone about her horrible show.

3. I've had this happen to me numerous times. One guy started ranting about how his tour bus broke down. And another woman was talking about how the world is much sadder place today because kids don't get childhoods. It's called stage banter. If I don't like it, I wont return.

Let me be blunt. Your statement that entertainers should "remember their place" reminded me of when I was in the south. Where "negroes" should remember their place. It's condescending and offensive. Entertainers are entitled to voice their opinion just as much as you and me. And guess what, they are also open to the consequences of you or me NOT attending their concert or paying for their next movie. But to say that they have some "place" that they need to remember to be, is patently offensive.

Peanut

07-21-2004, 09:56 AM

1. Please support this. I didn't give any implication of this, in fact....

Let me be blunt. Your statement that entertainers should "remember their place" reminded me of when I was in the south. Where "negroes" should remember their place. It's condescending and offensive. Entertainers are entitled to voice their opinion just as much as you and me. And guess what, they are also open to the consequences of you or me NOT attending their concert or paying for their next movie. But to say that they have some "place" that they need to remember to be, is patently offensive.

Yes, but those folks from the SOUTH generally were not paying those "negroes" to entertain them. I must agree, it would APPEAR as if the patrons may have been out of line now that more of the story is being released.

Let us all face it. We all DO have our "places" in society. My dh is a military officer. It would be just as inapropriate for me to start politicizing our next social trip to the O-Club as it is for entertainers to voice such inanities as we were led to believe she voiced. Now, if she had indeed "merely dedicated the song "Desperado" to Michael Moore" and left it at simply that, then the patrons were the ones who were W-A-Y out of line. I was not there. I'll probably never know. That I was not in attendance is also stating the obvious. Were you there?

I believe I may just be a tad too old-fashioned to actually feel as if society should maintain some semblance of proper DECORUM. Maybe my Southern in-laws are rubbing off on me or maybe, just maybe, I am not out there offending folks with my political views on a regular basis. I just come here and disgust you, KL, instead, and I do it in a debate forum...showing a full understanding of social etiquette and a decent understanding of an apropriate place and time to do so.

Peanut

07-21-2004, 09:59 AM

Oh, and sorry, I cannot support something I do not fully comprehend you wanting supported...for which point of the many you quoted do you require more supporting evidence? It may be difficult as more information has come out now that may counter things we state before having information that may or may not contradict our thoughts. For example, supposedly now it was an encore of the act in which she did this. Therefore, to claim they cut her show short would now be seen as false.

Mabel

07-21-2004, 10:16 AM

Peanut

07-21-2004, 10:35 AM

If I was to clarify or prove you implied a violation of Ronstadt's right to free speech, I believe this posting of yours does indeed imply same
(or do I mean infer? You choose.)

Ok. Maybe I'm a little confused here. What you are saying to these people is "SHUT UP" your place is not to speak or talk. Just sing? These are HUMAN BEINGS behind the voices and talents. But not only are they human beings with thoughts and opinions. They are for the most part Americans.

I may strongly disagree with Linda's point of view or Barbara Streisand or Whoopi, but I EVEN MORE STRONGLY SUPPORT their freedom to speak without being insulted by statements like "remember their place". Because their "PLACE" is to speak their mind and live with the consequences of speaking that peace.

Ok, KL, I concede that the last line of this comment softens the inference/implication of rights violation, but I still feel it is there.

And as part of my possibly off-kilter and old-fashioned leaning understanding of social decorum, I would NEVER get up in someone's face and say, "REMEMBER YOUR PLACE!"; however, I confess that I most assuredly would probably judge the propriety and crassness of one's behavior regarding an inapropriate situational action and react accordingly upon next possible encounter. It is all a part of social interaction.

However, to the best of my knowledge, Ms. Ronstadt is not lurking here and we are supposedly debating.

Echo2

07-21-2004, 10:41 AM

The casino is paying this woman to sing. She is getting PAID, she is not volunteering her time, therefore NO, she doesn't have the right to go up there and do whatever she wants. She sold the casino a "product" - her voice. If they found her show dissatisfactory they have every right to not "buy that product" again.

In which case she better not "say" anything between songs because she isn't getting paid to "talk". Or is it that she can only say what you want to hear ?

GracieMae

07-21-2004, 10:43 AM

In which case she better not "say" anything between songs because she isn't getting paid to "talk". Or is it that she can only say what you want to hear ?

Of course a certain ammount of talking is expected. Political speeches are not.

Mabel

07-21-2004, 10:50 AM

In which case she better not "say" anything between songs because she isn't getting paid to "talk". Or is it that she can only say what you want to hear ?

No, actually *I'm* saying that if her 'talk' in between makes people uncomfortable, and could cost this casino money, they have every right to terminate her employment. They didn't ask her to come and do whatever she wanted, they asked her to sing. Why should they suffer if she starts taking business away, when they are PAYING her?

Echo2

07-21-2004, 10:53 AM

My understanding is that it wasn't a speach. She was called out for an ovation and she dedicated a song to him and recomended his movie.

I don't think entertainers should get political when performing unless the performance was geared to be political from the start and advertised that way. But I also don't think that a short dedication and a recomendation is a big deal. If she had dedicated the song to Steven Spielberg and recomended seeing one of his movies would the audience have been as rude and obnoxious? I doubt it. The audience are the ones that I see making a bigger mistake. She may have used poor judgement, but their resonse was rude and borderline criminal. Throwing things at her, stomping out and pulling down posters. If these people represent the conservatives, in this coutry they are doing a poor job. She may have been wrong to say anything political, but the mob certainly did not respond in a mature and balanced way. This is just another example of the divisiveness that this country has moved to in the last three years.

GracieMae

07-21-2004, 10:56 AM

As I said before, if I'm paying to see a preformer sing I don't care what their political agenda is. Polatics is such a touchy subject she should have known better. Heck, Michael Moore is a touchy subject to many people.

Echo2

07-21-2004, 11:05 AM

Performers should stick to that old social rule about no religion or politics in polite company. People just are not polite when those two subjects are discussed.

GracieMae

07-21-2004, 11:08 AM

Performers should stick to that old social rule about no religion or politics in polite company. People just are not polite when those two subjects are discussed.

Exactally!

Slabobbin

07-21-2004, 12:04 PM

I think the customers were the most out of line, the club second and Linda third. My God people, she dedicated a song to him and recommended the movie (if what Echo is saying is true. Not that it isn't, I just don't want to research it so I'm putting in a discliamer in case someone calls me on this :jester1: ). If you as a paying customer can't handle a few minutes of an opinion you disagree with then you have bigger problems than wasted money on a ticket.

Boo, that's fine, boo to your hearts content but throwing things? Ripping down posters? A mob scene? Locking her out of her room and kicking her out? Geeze Louise, get a grip.

GracieMae

07-21-2004, 12:08 PM

Yes, the croud overreacted. The mod scene was rediculos. The fact is had Linda NOT brought polatics into her show it's probably wouldnt' have happened in the first place.

Slabobbin

07-21-2004, 12:12 PM

Yes, the croud overreacted. The mod scene was rediculos. The fact is had Linda NOT brought polatics into her show it's probably wouldnt' have happened in the first place.

But that is sooo shifting the personal responsibility onto to someone else. If you piss me off and I knock you one across the nose who is responsible for my actions? ME! I am responsible, you didn't make me hit you. I can always choose my reaction. Your response reminds me of the rapist who says "Well she was asking for it, she wore a short revealing outfit". Hog wash.

GracieMae

07-21-2004, 12:16 PM

I have already stated my feelings and they won't change. Though these people behaved horribly they were provoked.

Polatics and religion are touchy subjects and people tend to get emotional about them.

GracieMae

07-21-2004, 12:24 PM

Also Robyn, I feel your analogy was way off. I already said these people behaved horrible.

Your response reminds me of the rapist who says "Well she was asking for it, she wore a short revealing outfit". Hog wash.

Linda wasn't physically harmed. You are acting like I'd advocate physical violance which I do not and never would. This isn't a fair analogy at all.

Slabobbin

07-21-2004, 12:27 PM

Also Robyn, I feel your analogy was way off. I already said these people behaved horrible.

Linda wasn't physically harmed. You are acting like I'd advocate physical violance which I do not and never would. This isn't a fair analogy at all.

No, no, no. I wasn't saying or even trying to imply that you advocate physical violence. The analogy wasn't in reference to any type of violence. The analogy was in reference to you saying that basically she "caused" them to act the way she did and that if she would not have said anything that they wouldn't have did what they did. The analogy was about shifting personal responsibility not about advocating violence.

GracieMae

07-21-2004, 12:32 PM

Echo2

07-21-2004, 12:32 PM

Imature people respond with violence when provoked by words. Mature adults should know better. Violence is the first resort of the incompetant.

Linda was wrong and these people made it worse by acting like a group of rioting animals. Booing and walking out politly would have gotten the point across. There was no need to throw thing and tear down posters.

Slabobbin

07-21-2004, 12:47 PM

Robyn, some people are excitable. All it takes is a simple comment to set them off. They then behave like excitable people who are not thinking. Most people do not throw drinks and trash a place over comments. These people did. It ws sparked by her comment. That is what I am saying.

But if they are "excitable" to the point that they would do something like that they need to get help. It is THEIR issue and theirs alone. I agree that their behavior was sparked by her comment but I don't feel that she bears any resonsibility for their behavior. That's what I'm saying.

Mabel

07-21-2004, 12:49 PM

I think the customers were the most out of line, the club second and Linda third.
I think the customers were most out of line, Linda second, and I don't think the club WAS out of line. I sure as hell wouldn't continue paying someone who was going to lose me business. But I agree with you that Linda isn't to blame for the customers acting like children. In fact, Linda really didn't do anything "wrong" necessarily (she made a bad choice in judgement, IMO), but needs to accept that if she isn't "selling" what the club wants, she'll be let go.

Slabobbin

07-21-2004, 12:51 PM

I think the customers were most out of line, Linda second, and I don't think the club WAS out of line.

You don't think that locking her out of her room was wrong? Or that the "ban for life" was a little over the top?

Mabel

07-21-2004, 01:03 PM

Over the top - most certainly. Wrong? No, I don't think so. They were firing her, and did not want her on their property. They were paying for the luxery suite, so it's their right to not allow her to stay.
The ban for life was for as long as Timmons was in charge there, and it makes perfect sense. He hired her, she didn't work out and caused a riot, and he will never have her back.
I agree with you that he probably over reacted. But I still don't think what he did was "wrong".

Slabobbin

07-21-2004, 01:06 PM

Was her stuff still in her room? I mean I can see asking her not to come back (although I think this ban for life thing is way too dramatic) but the locking her out of her room thing gets to me. I call it wrong. Now granted on the sliding scale of wrongness it isn't up there with killing puppies or drunk driving but I still think they were in the wrong to do it.

Mabel

07-21-2004, 01:34 PM

I assume that her stuff was sent home with her. I don't know though, they don't mention it.

kingclick

07-21-2004, 01:58 PM

kingclick

07-21-2004, 02:08 PM

The casino is paying this woman to sing. She is getting PAID, she is not volunteering her time, therefore NO, she doesn't have the right to go up there and do whatever she wants. She sold the casino a "product" - her voice. If they found her show dissatisfactory they have every right to not "buy that product" again.
I totally agree! And that is the risk that entertainers take when they open their mouth!

mom2burgess

07-22-2004, 12:24 AM

I tend to look at it this way (her part in it at least) she was getting paid to do a job. Now I could choose to speak about whatever I want on the job, but I have to take responsibility that what I say could in fact get me fired. She has to also take responsability for her own comments while she is working.

However, the public was entirely out of line. The mob mentality over some words, is ridiculous. However, I don't understand why people tear apart thier town after thier team wins the superbowl, either.

I think the owner of the casino went WAY over the top as well

cevm2

07-22-2004, 03:09 AM

Came across this today and thought it might be interesting to posts the sight

http://www.billboard.com/bb/daily/article_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1000582932

Peanut

07-22-2004, 10:10 AM

Thanks for the link, cevm2. Have you introduced yourself anywhere yet? Regardless, welcome!

kingclick

07-22-2004, 11:58 AM

The power of the $$!!

GracieMae

07-22-2004, 12:00 PM

Now lets get the audience Peanut suggested :D

Keri

07-22-2004, 11:13 PM

Well I am a military spouse who sees no problem with her comments. So I would be more than happy to be a part of this "test audience" suggested earlier. I promise not to throw a temper tantrum, throw drinks, or rip down posters should she happen to dedicate a song to god while she is on stage since I am not a religious person.

The people in that audience should be ashamed of themselves. I lose more and more faith in humanity the more stories I read of "adults" behaving like that.