Could you be friends with someone you vehemently disagree with? [Archive]

Wind Songs

04-09-2005, 11:49 PM

Keri

04-09-2005, 11:55 PM

How 'bout you? Could you be good friends with someone whose viewpoints are totally against what you stand for?--depends on the issue. Most of the stuff we debate here are not deal breakers for me but it wouldn't leave much for us to talk about

And are you friends in real life with people like that?--nope. Most of my friends are very similar to myself. It just makes it much easier to have a friendship if you are on the same page, or at the very least, in the same book

Are there any "hot issues" that you could not compromise on in friendship?--abuse(child or spousal), swingers(couldn't be friends with them), cheaters(I ended a friendship last year over infidelity on her part). I'm sure there is more but those are the ones that come to mind.

Diva

04-10-2005, 07:04 AM

How 'bout you? Could you be good friends with someone whose viewpoints are totally against what you stand for? Like Keri said, it totally depends on the issue. There are issues that are immediate deal breakers, and others that would only be an issue if the friend could not respect our differing viewpoints and tried to ram her viewpoint down my throat all the time. Anyone who could't be respectful about differing viewpoints wouldn't stay my friend for long, even if the issue itself was pretty minor, mutual respect is a major thing IMO. Of course, if the issue itself was a dealbreaker (like, if one day a good friend of mine tried to convince me that paedophilia was perfectly okay) it wouldn't matter how respectful they were of my opinion to the contrary, I can't see myself being friends with someone like that.

And are you friends in real life with people like that?None with dealbreaker-type differences, obviously, since we wouldn't have stayed friends. The only one that springs to mind with whom I have a differing viewpoint on a fairly major issue is a dear, dear friend who is just the sweetest thing ever and whom I adore, but we have completely different religious views. The only reason I know, because we have NEVER discussed religion, is because it is evident in her house - there are religious overtones everywhere, from the bible quotes on the wall to the evangelical station on the radio. I can't emphasise enough how much I don't care. Like I said, we have NEVER discussed it, which means we have been respectful of each other's differing viewpoints on the matter (if she even knows what mine are); clearly, her faith is important to her, yet she has not presumed to proselityse to me or even brought the subject up in the two and a half years we have been fast friends. I, like I said, couldn't care less about her religious beliefs except inasfar as that they are part of making her the person she is, the person I love to bits, so I wouldn't have her any other way. The fact that our religious beliefs are different is of no import.

Are there any "hot issues" that you could not compromise on in friendship?If my "friend" thought to any form of what I would consider abuse of another person (whether it be an adult or child) was okay - that could be anything from physical abuse to verbal or sexual, it really doesn't matter. Habitual cheating and thinking it's fine; I wouldn't be "okay" with someone cheating "just once", but as long as they were truly sorry and I believed it really was a mistake they made I would still stick by them as a friend - I believe everyone is entitled to make a mistake and doesn't necessarily deserve to lose their friends over it. There probably are other things but I can't think of them right now.

Basically, I think it all hinges on respect for me. I can forgive most things except a basic respect for other human beings, which is why the dealbreakers for me are the issues where the person disrespects other people (as with abuse, habitual cheating, all the things above). A person without a basic respect for others cannot be trusted IMO.

Val

04-10-2005, 07:58 AM

I AM friends with people I vehemently disagree with on a number of issues. I think that most of the time I can disagree respectfully with someone and still maintain a friendship. When they start making disparaging remarks or really insensitive comments about things that are dear to me, though, I often will distance myself from that person and go from friendship to an acquaintanceship. Or if I believe the person is doing something so harmful that it is having a dangerous effect on their life, and they are not open to change, then again I will distance the friendship.

eva

04-10-2005, 08:01 AM

I think it's not viewpoints, but attitudes that would ruin any friendship for me. My parents have vastly different political views than I. My husband and I even have a couple issues that we really disagree upon. But if you are a decent person with compassion, treat people well, and can agree to respectfully discuss and when it gets heated agree to disagree....then it usually works out.

I don't have super super close friends though. I have friends - but my husband is my best friend and my parents and siblings are my next closest. I tend to not want to surround myself with anyone with a lot of drama -- and it seems so many people I meet have a lot of drama in their lives! (I don't mean heartache or misfortune....I mean just general dysfunction)

I haven't had a "best friend" since before marriage so it's hard for me to picture but....I think it would be hard, for instance, to see my best friend do something to her child that I really thought was abuse or disrespect her marriage or something like that. Things like that might end a friendship.

eva

04-10-2005, 08:03 AM

Oh and honestly, I think actual proselytizing from a friend could get old. That's one of the reasons I could never become a born again Christian....if you really believe the people you love are going to hell, how can you keep from trying to convert them? And yet when you do so, you just push them away. :(

Peanut

04-10-2005, 08:04 AM

Basically, I think it all hinges on respect for me. I can forgive most things except a basic respect for other human beings, which is why the dealbreakers for me are the issues where the person disrespects other people (as with abuse, habitual cheating, all the things above). A person without a basic respect for others cannot be trusted IMO.

This pretty much sums up what I would have posted if Diva hadn't already done it. MUTUAL RESPECT and respect for others would be how I would expand upon it, though.

As long as we respectfully disagreed regarding our differences (for instance, don't swing when I am around, to borrow an example from Keri's post), fine. Just as they may request that I not swear around them or drink alcohol, or whatever. :huh: (I am a fairly run-of-the-mill person IRL and my vices aren't TOO bizarre in the eyes of routine society.)

As for deep, profound, lifelong friendships, something too extreme and contrary to my beliefs or chosen lifestyle may indeed compromise the potential depth of a friendship. I can be kind and nice and firendly with anyone, but I am not exactly goint to bond deeply with someone who performs human sacrifices in their living room because Master Fred says they need to do so. (pretty bizarre example to punctuate my intent, but I am sure you get the drift...)

Slabobbin

04-10-2005, 10:14 AM

I hope I won't sound too closed minded if I were to say that it would be hard to have a deep friendship with someone who had really different beliefs than my own. I am not a "live and let live" person, I am not one who can easily let things "roll off my back". Now my mom...she is very much a "blase" kind of person when it comes to other's beliefs, she would have no problem being friends with someone who believed differently than her. But I am a passionate person and I get worked up about things so it would be hard for me.

Jory

04-10-2005, 10:20 AM

How 'bout you? Could you be good friends with someone whose viewpoints are totally against what you stand for?

I could.

And are you friends in real life with people like that?

I am.

Are there any "hot issues" that you could not compromise on in friendship?
Hot issues for me are:

Racism/sexism/bigotry in general.
Abuse

Most anything else I can tolerate as long as it doesn't become an issue of someone trying to convert me to any number of beliefs politically or spiritually. I am willing to listen, but it has to be in an objective context. I probably wouldn't be close friends with someone who is a polar opposite, but I would still consider them a friend.

Epicurus

04-10-2005, 10:24 AM

I get along with most anyone. I am sure we would be fine and have fun if we were to meet:)

Collette

bRATmom

04-10-2005, 11:18 AM

I would have no problems at all... I find common ground in which to be able to talk to anybody. I dont look at anybody, and do carry overs... we all have our hot butten issues, THIS IS A DEBATE BOARD, I expect people to debate, and debate hot and heavy on issues they are passionate about. I do, However, in real life, I avoid the contraversary. I find common ground. Im betting that we would have a blast if we all got together.... image the party!

Slabobbin

04-10-2005, 11:36 AM

I can get along with most anyone in real life. I can keep my mouth shut (most of the time, lol) even if it kills me. But I am one of those people who stews on stuff, I can't help it. So, for example, if someone did something I was really bothered by, like swatting their year old baby constantly for just being a normal toddler, I could keep my mouth shut but it would bother me. I would hold the opinion that it was their child, their business but it would still bother me. Life is too short and I am bothered by too many things that I have no control over. I DO have control over being around such person or not so why would I choose to be around them if they bothered me and caused me more grief than happiness? Friendship and life in general should be about happiness...if it doesn't bring you happiness and you can eliminate it then you should IMO.

FaeryGem

04-10-2005, 11:45 AM

I get along well with most people. There are things that I won't tolerate such as racism etc. BUT I definitely won't be friends with anyone who considers my religion a joke or that its just a "phase" Im going through. If they can't and won't at least respect my views then I don't want them as a friend.

Julie
xxx

kingclick

04-10-2005, 12:18 PM

I was just thinking about all of the people here who disagree with me a lot (all of you? :jester1: ) and I was just wondering how we would all get along in real life.

I am actually a much more mellow and laid back person than I come off as on the boards, even if my views are strong on a lot of issues. I think I'm pretty easy to get along with in real life.

I guess I'm wondering if you all could be friends in real life with someone who has polar opposite views from you? For instance, I can't see Def getting chummy with any right winger, even if the person is a great person (I could be wrong of course, but that's the impression I get).

How 'bout you? Could you be good friends with someone whose viewpoints are totally against what you stand for?

And are you friends in real life with people like that?

Are there any "hot issues" that you could not compromise on in friendship?

I see lifestyle differently than I see issues. Some types of lifestyles would make it hard for me to be friends with a person. However issues can be argued and disagreed upon but still not endanger a relationship.

Abuse is not an issue in my opinion. It's a lifestyle.

There is no issue that can endanger my relationship with another person, like someone said before it's how they treat me.

Clio

04-10-2005, 12:39 PM

I think I generally hate everyone first and then get to like anyone who's worth liking. It saves a lot of time.

Peanut

04-10-2005, 12:44 PM

Ahhh, Clio, Clio, Clio...are we related? :ouch:

Jory

04-10-2005, 01:10 PM

Original post by WS: Are there any "hot issues" that you could not compromise on in friendship?

Keri's response:--abuse(child or spousal), swingers(couldn't be friends with them), cheaters(I ended a friendship last year over infidelity on her part). I'm sure there is more but those are the ones that come to mind.

I am curious as to why someone's sex life has an effect on your friendship with them (swingers in particular, I can understand cheaters).

Def.I.Nition

04-10-2005, 01:17 PM

I can and have been friends with people that I vehemently disagree. However, I have a very difficult time with homophobic people (not that they are likely to want to be my friend anyway).

Wind Songs

04-10-2005, 01:50 PM

Another thing about "real" life is that a lot of times these issues don't even come up. I have no idea how most of my (non-Christian) friends feel about abortion, for instance. And it doesn't really matter to me if we truly enjoy being with each other. I guess on these boards our views are out there for the world to see, and that really isn't the case in real life.

I do tend to spend the majority of my time in real life with Christians though, mainly because I take comfort in being around people who share my faith. I don't think I could take the heat that I sometimes do in debates if I didn't have people who I could turn to in real life who share my views. I sometimes feel like a fish out of water here (although I really do like it here, and I like the people here), and it is just comforting to spend time with people who I can trust won't mock or belittle my faith, because they believe the same things I do.

I'm not sure there is any real divisive issue that would cause me to stop being friends with someone other than if they were abusing or mistreating another person.

Def.I.Nition

04-10-2005, 02:05 PM

Let me do clarify what I said earlier. While I can be friends with someone who disagrees with me, I simply cannot have sex with a staunch right winger. I can't imagine getting booty bumped by someone who associates themselves with a party that wants the government to control their weiners. My boyfreind could NEVER be Arthur Finkelstein.

mom2burgess

04-10-2005, 05:03 PM

MOST of my friends have different views than me, from abortion issues to religion to politics LOL
I LIKE being around people who are different than me. I LIKE discussing things and sharing view points. I am friends with various people on the net who think TOTALLY different with me and that's cool. I could NOT be friends with a person who won't even listen to my opinions with an open mind or who could not discuss something without attempting to convert me to thier way of thinking, or thier religion.

For example, I speak to Gracie on the phone alot. She is conservative, I am not. She is pro life, I am not, she is Christian, I am not. And yet I consider her a good friend, and I am sure that if we were to ever meet in person, my views on her would not change a bit.
Same with Peanut. I probably have more in common with Peanut than I do Gracie, but still, we were able to talk, hang out and I tortured her with my talk of Starbucks!! LOL

Michele

04-11-2005, 08:43 AM

Of course! If I agreed with everything everyone around me believed in or felt strongly about, that would be rather boring. ;) I disagree strongly with some of my closest friends about core issues, I still love em and they love me. We meet in the middle.

Neurotic1

04-11-2005, 08:44 AM

I pretty much agree with the rest :)

I am friends with a lot of people who I disagree with on many issues. I'm LDS so I actually disagree with a ton of lifestyle choices people are making. But, I'm social and don't want to live in a bubble ;)

But, I tend to surround myself with people who have similar interests and personalities. I can get a long with most anyone and I am not easily offended or offensive, but it makes more sense and is more fun to be with people who share a similar sense of humor and are not obnoxious to me.

I have one friend who I adore. She and are are absolutely not able to discuss one topic. We know it and so we don't. We strongly disagree and the one time we did talk about it, she ended up crying and I felt just awful for hurting her feelings. So we don't go there. But we disagree about almost everything else and we can discuss those things. And we share a similar heart and get along famously.

Myboysmom

04-11-2005, 08:10 PM

Could you be good friends with someone whose viewpoints are totally against what you stand for? Well, I consider my sister and I friends.

And are you friends in real life with people like that? See above.

Are there any "hot issues" that you could not compromise on in friendship? I once had a pregnant friend tell me if she found out she was carrying a child with Downs Syndrome, Spina Bifida or any other "disability" she would abort.

I told her that was too bad because I thought we would always be friends.

Wind Songs

04-11-2005, 08:17 PM

I once had a pregnant friend tell me if she found out she was carrying a child with Downs Syndrome, Spina Bifida or any other "disability" she would abort.

I told her that was too bad because I thought we would always be friends.

While I find it abhorrent to abort a child just because it's imperfect, I wouldn't necessarily dismiss a friend just for saying she would do that. A lot of times peope have ideas in their heads, and when actually faced with the issue, they realize they could never truly go through with it.

bRATmom

04-11-2005, 08:39 PM

yep, ask my friend jenny, who will tell you up and down, that I said I would never have kids, if I did, it would be c section all the way, cuz no way in hell was a child passing through these legs... and that in NO way shape or form, would *I* allow a child to suckle off my boobs.....

natural childbirth, all three.... and I breastfed all three....

people can and do change. and for those who cant, if you cannot find common ground with them, then your (general) are the looser, not the other person. everybody has something to give, you must uncover it.

Myboysmom

04-11-2005, 08:51 PM

While I find it abhorrent to abort a child just because it's imperfect, I wouldn't necessarily dismiss a friend just for saying she would do that. A lot of times peope have ideas in their heads, and when actually faced with the issue, they realize they could never truly go through with it.

At the time I was willing to. At this time, she realizes she "had a lot to learn".

Fortunately for both of us, it never came to that.

Ginny

04-11-2005, 11:28 PM

I have many friends with vastly different viewpoints from my own. Unless there was tension or the differing viewpoints caused one friend to treat the other one poorly, I don't see why disagreement would rule out friendship.

China Cat Sunflower

04-11-2005, 11:33 PM

How 'bout you? Could you be good friends with someone whose viewpoints are totally against what you stand for?

What I care about is 1. ability, 2. genuiness, and 3. personal ethics. Work hard and have something to offer, be the real deal, say what you mean and mean what you say, and be trustworthy and reliable. I can let everything else slide.

Chris

Soulshine

04-12-2005, 09:27 AM

I can be friends with anyone because it's easy to find a comman ground somewhere in our friendship, and it's ok to disagree about most major issues. Some friends of mine who are far right, well, we just avoid talking about politics then. But there's got to be a mutual respect between us; to me, that's the most important thing.

I once had a pregnant friend tell me if she found out she was carrying a child with Downs Syndrome, Spina Bifida or any other "disability" she would abort.

This is the one issue I would have serious problems with in a person, as my daughter has Down syndrome. I've seen many people out there who are ignorant to those with disabilities, even after I tell them that I have a child with one. I cannot be friends with these people, as they're unwilling to accept my sweet girl for who she is. It's my one and only breaking point with people.

Sage1

04-12-2005, 10:59 AM

The good thing about friendship is . . .ya get to pick each other.

I have a 'ladder' for my friendships.

First, you are an aquaintance, such as a co-worker or the forum people here.

If I relate to you in anyway, and want to know you better, you become a friend.

If the feelings are mutual, and we spend our personal time together, we become good friends.

The highest step of the ladder is, Best Friend. That takes time, trust and honor to become.

A person that I disagree with on most issue's has very little in common with me, so they remain in first or second step. For instance, an anti-gay rights person can become a friend, but not a good friend. They wouldn't like me because if the gay issue came up, I would let them know their prejudisms were based on ignorance.

I am not known to back down on issue's that I stand strong on. And I stand strong with my gay brothers and sisters. So, if you are anti-gay rights, you are not going to like me anyway. Therefore, nothing but a student/teacher relationship can develope. :eyebrow:

Sage

Wind Songs

04-12-2005, 11:08 AM

A person that I disagree with on most issue's has very little in common with me, so they remain in first or second step. For instance, an anti-gay rights person can become a friend, but not a good friend. They wouldn't like me because if the gay issue came up, I would let them know their prejudisms were based on ignorance.

And you accuse ME of being unloving??? :eek:

You can't be good friends with me because I think differently than you do? Yep. That's a really loving attitude you have there.

I don't put conditions of my friendships.

Sage1

04-12-2005, 11:50 AM

And you accuse ME of being unloving??? :eek:

Why thank you WS. Considering I have learned that our definitions of 'unloving' are on the opposite ends of the spectrum, I take that as a compliment from you.

You can't be good friends with me because I think differently than you do? Yep. That's a really loving attitude you have there.

Ya might want to read my words again so you can see what I actually said.
"For instance, an anti-gay rights person can become a friend, but not a good friend. They wouldn't like me because if the gay issue came up, I would let them know their prejudisms were based on ignorance."

I don't put conditions of my friendships.

:howling: And I bet you really believe that! Try saying that to a gay person after exposing your true self, and see if they believe that.

WS, the more you post to me, the more you are exposing your :Booty:

What happened to that person that first came to this forum? Getting a little to confident, are you?

Sage

samu2

04-12-2005, 11:50 AM

I don't put conditions of my friendships.

Dont you? I do,if my friend was hurting me or whatever we would stop becoming friends,friendship is not unconditonal,well at least not to most people I know.

Im very fussy who I become good friends with,infact I like very few people but once you are in my heart you are there to stay.

I know a lot of Christians on another message board,I resepct them all,I listen to them and never make them feel bad for it but I will never been close friends with someone,like Slab said I stew on things and would not be able to let it go.

I can be friends with people who disagree with the small things but not what I class as the big things,Christians think I worship the devil and am going to hell,I cant be friends with someone who thinks that way about me,I can talk to them but I will never be close friends with them,I have friends who have different religious beliefs then me to a certain extent and thats great,it would be boring if we agreed on everything so I guess it is really lifestyle differences that would stop me being close to someone,and Christians have a different lifestyle to me ;)

BTW Im just using Christians as an example because it is the first thing I thought off :)

Michele

04-12-2005, 11:57 AM

Let's keep this from getting personal guys. :)

Neurotic1

04-12-2005, 01:28 PM

Christians think I worship the devil and am going to hell

kind of a side note, but not all Christians or Christian faiths believe this. Before dismissing all Christians...you might want to check out the details ;)

Wind Songs

04-12-2005, 01:55 PM

What happened to that person that first came to this forum? Getting a little to confident, are you?

Sage

I didn't change at all. But you have turned into a royally condescending self-righteous bitch.

Please forgive me Michele and Gracie. I'm not going to put up with her anymore.

Sage, don't bother addressing me in the future. You are now on ignore.

Sage1

04-12-2005, 02:15 PM

I didn't change at all. But you have turned into a royally condescending self-righteous bitch.

Please forgive me Michele and Gracie. I'm not going to put up with her anymore.

Sage, don't bother addressing me in the future. You are now on ignore.

The names that you call me does not reflect on me. They reflect who you are. I am so sorry for you that you do not see that.

As far as addressing you in the future, this is a public debate forum. If I choose to address your words, that will be up to me. If you choose to put me on your ignore list, is up to you, and I promise I won't lose any sleep over it, okay. ;)

Sage

GracieMae

04-12-2005, 02:43 PM

GracieMae

04-12-2005, 02:44 PM

I wanted to add I don't feel this way about ALL debates, just certain subjects.

Sage1

04-12-2005, 03:12 PM

Sage, Wind Songs is well within her right to place you on ignore. I also want to say I don't feel at ease to debate many topics anymore because having an unpopular opinion I would likely be attacked.

Things have changed here as far as debating goes since we opened, and not necessarily for the better :(

I don't see where I disputed that WS didn't have the right to put me on her ignore list. Did I miss something?

Btw, attacked is a subjective word. It has not been my intent to attack anyone, nor do I feel guilty with the accusation. If someone can't handle an opposing opinion and they post their views on a public forum . . .what do you expect me to do about it? Would you prefer I leave? This forum is not a very important part of my life. I can handle it if you prefer I leave because I have a very strong opinion against SOME Christian beliefs.

I don't plan on pretending that I believe something else just to "fit in" here. Nor do I plan on being quiet when someone post their judgments against my gay brothers and sisters. I am who I am and I stand strong on a few issues in my life. If that goes against what you want for your debate forum, please, feel free to be honest with me.

Sage

GracieMae

04-12-2005, 03:20 PM

Actually I prefer the ignore feature to be used over fighting and argueing on the board.

The rest of my post wasn't aimed at you. It was a general statement about the "rules" of debate. At one time it was pretty respectful if someone didn't agree with you (again, you in general) but it seems lately too many people go for blood if someone dares to disagree. I find that a shame :(

If you and WS can't get along I think it's best you ignore each other.

Pops In

04-12-2005, 03:26 PM

Could you be friends with someone you vehemently disagree with?

Apparently not. :D

GracieMae

04-12-2005, 03:29 PM

To answer the OP of course I can. Very few of my friends share the same exact views. How boring would it be if we all thought exactally alike :)

Pops In

04-12-2005, 03:33 PM

Seriously, to use a football term, it's all about playing the ball and not the man.

The trouble with these boards is, the ref can't be on the field all the time.

Wind Songs

04-12-2005, 03:37 PM

Apparently not. :D

Pops, you know you love me.

I love you, foreskin and all. :D

Sage1

04-12-2005, 03:50 PM

Seriously, to use a football term, it's all about playing the ball and not the man.

The trouble with these boards is, the ref can't be on the field all the time.

I agree. And that is what I am here to do. Practice debating and discussing the issues rather than the person. I do my best not to shoot the messenger, even though I am as human as the next person.

And I also think the problem with this board is that many are here to make friends rather than really debate the issues. I have no problem with that, but why post in a debate forum if ya (general) can't handle an opposing and the emotional opinions of others? So what if it gets a little heated at times. I am mature enough to get over the little bumps in RL, I am sure I can on this forum.

Sage

GracieMae

04-12-2005, 03:52 PM

That is why I avoid certain topics like the plague. By doing so I can remain my usual sweet, wonderful self :D

Michele

04-12-2005, 03:54 PM

Pops, you know you love me.

I love you, foreskin and all. :D

ROFLMAO!

Wind Songs

04-12-2005, 03:58 PM

That is why I avoid certain topics like the plague. By doing so I can remain my usual sweet, wonderful self :D

Don't let Gracie fool you. She is a shark.

NANOOP NANOOP NANOOP NANOOP

(That is Jaws coming at you in case you can't tell. :D)

GracieMae

04-12-2005, 04:01 PM

I resemble that remark WS :paranoid:

samu2

04-12-2005, 04:41 PM

kind of a side note, but not all Christians or Christian faiths believe this. Before dismissing all Christians...you might want to check out the details

They think I worship the devil because I do mediumship work ;) ive never met one who does not think satan is involved in that but I am sure there are some :)

Meiri

04-14-2005, 09:42 AM

If I couldn't be friends with people who have different opinions and beleifs than I, I'd be extremely lonely. Even DH and I don't agree on Everything. Though our "worst" arguments (on issues, not home matters) tend to be ones in which we agree but are approaching the issue from two different angles. I can see that but he can't.

OTOH, I have had a good friend decide that she could no longer be friends with me due to my beliefs. Fact is it was her beliefs that were the problem. There'd been no problem for some 14 years, but suddenly there was? get real. It has become very difficult since then to be as open as I should be able to be, having felt what prejudice does on an emotional level. Four years it's been, and sometimes it still hurts.